Shock tippet for toothy critters / "Dog leg" layout from Jeff Barefoot's message

Walter & Group.........

From Walter Simberski:

Gordy - I attended a pike fishing seminar last winter with one of our local shop owners and former pike fishing guides. His recommendation for large pike,

which would be similar to muskie, was titanium wire shock tippet which can be tied with many of the same knots that would be used for mono.

 

Walter

 

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Walter....

 

I have used the titanium wire (varioius brand names).  You are correct in that it can be tied with some of our mono knots.  Even this failed, however, on the spinner sharks.  Works fine for most other toothy critters.

 

Gordy

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From Ken Cole in answer to Jeff Barefoot's brain teaser :-

 

Evening, Gordy

If I'm reading the problem right, there is a 12" overpowered loop rolling out that suddenly produces a 3'-4' dogleg in the lay-out.

In an effort to get my answers down to fit on a business card:

The cast has run out of energy dissipating line and leader before the energy is used up. The line and leader "kick" around the loop radius at the end of the turn-over, heading off in whatever direction they were unrolling in (down, sideways, whatever).

Easy to reproduce by removing the leader (but not too healthy for the fly line).

Ken Cole

Texas Fly Fishing Outfitters

FFF/Certified Casting Instructor

214 969-1030

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Ken ....

 

I think you are correct about that. "Dog legs" and "fold back" of the leader is caused by this for most casts.        Gordy

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From Damon Newpher....

 

Hi Gordy,

This message is for Gary.  Gary, Steve Wascher, from jamestown NY, is a local expert on Musky on the fly.  He fishes Chataqua, Niagara River and several other destinations every summer for Muskies.  I've been with him several times and have never had one shear my leader.  He would be a good contact for his leader system.  He also fishes the Allegheny river system.  Thanks.

Damon

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Let's have more of you try to tackle the brain teaser from Jeff Barefoot.  It's a good one !

 

Gordy

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Repeating Jeff's brain teaser:-

 

Hi Folks,

 

    Here's something to think about.  You have just thrown an overpowered hook cast. Anatomically the style in which you did it, whether wrist flick, forearm flip, etc or whatever is not what we should focus on. If it lands to the left or right the loop plane had to be at least somewhat in the horizontal. That’s a given. So please let's not discuss any of those factors.  Let's just say that an overpowered horizontal loop was created by one means or another. 

    Here's the issue in which I'm very interested in your opinion. OK the loop is overpowered and it's tight......let's say the angular velocity is an honest m......mmm one foot. OK, so now it's a one foot overpowered horizontal loop.  Now imagine in slow motion that this loop is unrolling and unrolling. The fly leg is getting shorter and shorter and going from dynamic to static........now the leader [short and blunt taper] starts to turn over..... now there is only 36" of leader remaining to turn over......now there is only 24" of leader left to turn over...... and at last now there is only 12" left.  [Now picture these freeze frame photographs in your mind] From 12" left then 6" then 3" then all the way to 0". Now due to an angular velocity of only 12" [hence the 12" loop] during the caster's input and a a surplus of energy that will no doubt not only straighten the leader but "more".  Now it's this "more" that I'm very interested in discussing. How do we get a hooking layout with a 3 or 4 foot dogleg? How does a 12" overpowered loop swing completely into 36" to 48" layout in the opposite direction? 

       We know that it must be technically defined as a cast/aerial/mend but let's define it in more detail.  What put the sharp radius of the hook there? 

 

Let's stay focused on this one.

 

Jeff Barefoot

 

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Before I come in with my own answer, I'd like Jeff to clarify two things:

 

1.  What he means by the, "dog leg".  (I'm reading it as a right angle hook cast layout .... but some might interpret this as meaning that the leader never straigntened and landed while folded back)

 

2.)  Given that there is a 12" loop.  I look at this as produced to the rod unloading 12" from the oncoming line.   I'm fuzzy as to what Jeff means by the angular velocity being one foot. (?)

 

Help us here, Jeff.........

 

Gordy