ol Al....& Jerry:
Let's take loop size a step further.
You can adjust loop size by where you unload your rod at RSP. One way to look at it, is to unload it with the tip of the rod a tiny bit below the level of the oncoming line for a small loop. Unloading it a greater distance from the oncoming line yields a larger loop. In the first case, you unload with the rod tip at RSP a tiny bit below the SLP, and in the second, you unload at RSP a greater distance below the SLP.
Now let's get into more detail:
We can also look at loop size control in relation to where in the stroke we apply some convexity to the otherwise SLP. We can do that by increasing rod arc early in the stroke, late (just before RSP) .....or we can do it the way a beginner is likely to do it, ie. all through the stroke. (No SLP)
This yields different kinds of loops, as follows:
1.) A narrow loop is formed by placing a small amount of convexity of the rod tip path (brief increase in rod arc) very near the end of the stroke.
2.) A wide loop can be formed in 3 ways:-
a.) By placing INCREASED convexity (increase in rod arc arc) a bit sooner than in 1.), and near the end of the stroke. THIS YIELDS A WELL CONTROLLED WIDE LOOP WHEN ONE IS NEEDED. The rod leg is lower and the fly leg is fairly straight. (Often used for casting weighted flies.)
b.) By placing the increased convexity at the start of the stroke, then going to SLP until the very end of it. THIS YIELDS A WIDE LOOP WITH THE FLY END OF THE LOOP HIGH ABOVE THE ROD END. If carried to extreme, it yields a hard to control open loop. Some casters use this one when casting with the wind to gain a, "Kite" effect.
c.) When placing the convexity (increased rod arc for the amount of line carried and the bend of the rod) we get the scenario of a big wide out of control loop. This is what we see with some new casters.
Now, we find a different way of looking at all this as we talk with Lefty Kreh or read his stuff on loop size.
Lefty says: "The size of the loop is determined by the distance that you speed up and stop."
For years, I disagreed with him. Then, one day, he explained what he meant by that. He explained that if you speed up and stop over a long distance, you usually DO unload farther below the SLP or the oncoming line....and if you speed up and stop over a short distance, you usually don't bring the rod tip much below the SLP, so you end up with a small loop.
Now Lefty knows full well that his way of explaining it is not strictly according to physics, but he does this BECAUSE IT GETS INTO HIS STUDENT'S BRAINS faster.
One of his tricks in teaching a student to make a small loop is to tell him to try to strike the rod tip by aiming the cast at it. Amazing how well that works. Great for instant results with students, but not good for teaching folks at an MCI level, because it doesn't teach the mechanics of loop control.....so it's sort of a "bandade fix".
Now, too much knowledge can be a problem on some exams. For the folks I'm coaching for the CCI exams, I don't go into all this. I keep it super-simple, like this:
1.) For a tight loop, you need a straight line path of the rod tip.
2.) For a large loop, you need a convex path of the rod tip.
3.) A concave path of the rod tip will often result in a tailing loop.
Now, once you know the details, you realize that this is an oversimplification as we get to the Master level .
Gordy
From: "Allen Crise" <flysoup@xxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "" <flysoup@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: jerry_puckett2001@xxxxxxxxx, hillshead@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: loops
Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 11:53:30 -0600
Howyd Jerry
Let me start with you are thinking, I have to admit that.But part of what you are saying
is repeated what some one else said. Let me strat YOU thinking.
If you are making a forward stroke you have the rod tip traveling SLP.
Now think on this. How are you going to change the loop size?
You said that 'the loop' is formed at RSP. I agree. What size is the loop at RSP?
Now how do you make it bigger. Not changeing the SLP or power. Just make the loop bigger.
think think
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Would you lower the rod tip just a little to let the loop travel out over your rod tip? You did right?
Now drop the tip lower did the loop get bigger.
OH look if you let the rod drop a lot you can pull the loop open even more. Another way
to make big loops with a SLP and no energy loss.
ol Al
more latter lunch time is over
Allen Crise FFF Master Casting Instructor
Hawk Ridge Tackle & Flycasting School
2508 A County Road 1011
Glen Rose, Tx. 76043
254-897-2045
------- Original Message -------
From : jerry puckett[mailto:jerry_puckett2001@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent : 2/20/2006 10:35:53 AM
To : hillshead@xxxxxxxxxxx; hlhpc@xxxxxxx; flysoup@xxxxxxxxxx
Cc :
Subject : RE: loops
Gordy and Al, comments and suggestions on how I can improve on this would be appreciated. Thanks and Loops as you desire them, Jerry