Loop formation problem 2

Walter & Group...

[GH] George Foster answers our questions in the attachment. (I placed it as .doc as well as pdf).

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[GH] From Ken Cole:

Evening, Gordy:

QUESTION 1.) CAN YOU CAN TELL US HOW YOU HAVE HANDLED THIS SITUATION IN YOUR TEACHING EXPERIENCES? Stop the rod sooner (with less rotation placed at the end of the casting motion or stroke). I pinched this one from Bill Gammel.

QUESTION 2.) WHAT RECOMMENDATIONS WOULD YOU MAKE TO A STUDENT ON HOW TO ACCOMPLISH THE TASK OF ADJUSTING LOOP SIZE ? Play with the timing of the rod stop; i.e., sooner/tighter, later/bigger (with varied rotation placed at the end of the casting motion or stroke). Also from Bill back when I took my CI test.

QUESTION 3.) IS IT POSSIBLE TO ACHIEVE UP TO 6' WIDE LOOPS WHILE MAINTAINING PARALLEL LOOP LEGS ? Yes, see answer to #2, but hard to do with short casts; requires a little more line carry. By varying the amount and placement of rotation, and varying the stop, I've found I am able to make a domed fly leg with a straight rod leg, straight fly leg with a rounded rod leg, straight fly and rod leg, or domed fly/rounded rod leg while someone shouts out the line shape he wants to see as I'm casting. Straight from the late Tom White. Thanks, Tom!

Ken Cole

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[GH From Gary Davison:

QUESTION 1.) CAN YOU CAN TELL US HOW YOU HAVE HANDLED THIS SITUATION IN YOUR TEACHING EXPERIENCES?

Tell the client to "Stop the Rod Sooner". "Stop Sooner".

Have them cast and you place your hand in front of the rod so they can not pull the rod down. Provide physical contact as they are casting to get the point across with them finishing the forward cast with the rod in the higher position at the stop.

Word pictures:

1.) Fly Swatter hitting a fly on the wall directly in front of you.

2.) Driving a nail with a hammer into a wall directly in front of you.

3.) Water cup if you have one half full of water sending water straight out in front of the caster at the end of the cast stroke

4.) Paint brush drill send the water out in front to target not at your feet or water.

5.) Bottle on a stick drill. Send the bottle to the target not the ground.

Al Crise had a great way of getting to the crust of the problem fast with just a few words. He use to demo the cast and identify different position of the cast before the lesson. As we walked the line he would approach a student that had a problem and would tell them in just a few words what portion of the cast they needed to focus on. He would watch them make a couple of cast, then add any additional comments if and when needed and then walk to the next student while they worked on that specific aspect of the cast.

Here is the breakdown of the stages he would address.

Lift

Stop One

Stroke

Stop Two

Rest.

These key words would identify the cast sequence that needed tuning. He would say Stop Two needs to be "Sooner".

Stop Two needs to be "More Abrupt"

Stop Two needs to be "Your words to get the point across"

QUESTION 2.) WHAT RECOMMENDATIONS WOULD YOU MAKE TO A STUDENT ON HOW TO ACCOMPLISH THE TASK OF ADJUSTING LOOP SIZE ?

Essence:

The rod tip position at the stop in relationship to the rod tip path made during the casting stroke.

What I mean by this if you make a convex rod tip path with a wide arc then you will have a non loop.

If you have a straight line path of the rod tip with a wide arc then you have a wide controlled loop.

QUESTION 3.) IS IT POSSIBLE TO ACHIEVE UP TO 6' WIDE LOOPS WHILE MAINTAINING PARALLEL LOOP LEGS ?

Yes

If you maintain a straight line path of the rod tip with a wide arc at the end of the stroke.

A straight line path of your stroke will produce the Fly Leg needed on the Loop.

Then with you adding convexity near the end of the casting stoke to lower the position of the rod tip below the straight line path of the line, will allow you to maintain a controlled wide loop with Parallel Legs.

All the best

Gary

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[GH] From Hank Wu :

Hi Gordy,

for my personal experience, the casters always tip down when they want to cast harder or faster, especially for the quick presentation. They totally forgot the SLP and trajectory.

How to fix it? I will tell the caster try to throw a ball with a big and long spoon and hit a target with the ball. Then try to imagine the rod as the spoon and the line as the ball. Sometimes it fixes the tip down problem.

Btw, I always find that some casters tends to tip down because they can't handle their backcast well. If they have a slack or lazy backcast, when they change the direction and try to present the fly, they can't feel the weight or tension of the line. So they use the bigger stroke and bigger arc try to get the tension feeling. Then always tip down. How to fix this problem? You have to fix the last backcast.

About question 3,

you can't get a parallel loop about 6' wide. Because once you are out of the SLP, the loop is not parallel.

Cheers

Hank