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Walter & Group....
[GH] Some of you may have received our last message, "Loop formation problem 9" twice. My apologies for the duplication.
Gordy
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[GH] From Ted Warren:
I really appreciate this discussion as a newer CCI, and an older one (65). I feel better knowing this performance standard is a challenge for many of us and it has renewed my commitment to achieving it.
At some point, I hope you will explain what size loops are really expected in the 85' cast? How does the loop size expectation vary with the amount of line out and why?
Ted
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[GH] Ted,
Let's tackle it right now.
On Task 12 ( the distance cast ) I suspect the Master Testing Committee purposely left out any specific size requirements for the loops.
When I serve as an examiner, I like to see loops on the forward and back casts which are reasonably consistent with one another. I realize that most expert distance casters don't have exactly the same diameter loops for both casts. In fact, the back cast loop is almost always larger than the forward cast loop. Arguments have occurred as to exactly where these loops should be measured on those long casts.
It should be a good demonstration of a TEACHING CAST, so even if the distance is reached, easy form is expected. To do this with the ease expected of a Master, it isn't likely that the distance or proper layout will be accomplished with large, inefficient loops for either back cast or forward cast and/or loop legs being too far out of parallel (except for a bit of sag on the back cast loop cause by gravity when carrying large amounts of line).
Here, I think it would be well to gain more insight from members of that committee. I'm certain they discussed this at length when they came up with the present task wording. As most of you know, Joe Libeu and Dusty Sprague have been co-chairmen of the MCI Testing Committee. They now serve as senior advisors on the Committee which is now headed by Pete Greenan.
Gordy
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[GH] Here is Dusty Sprague's reply :
Gordy, your rationale below is about what we considered when coming up with the task…..consistent, reasonably parallel loops forming a good teaching cast that will consistently achieve the 85 foot distance….no need to specify a loop size because to achieve that distance the loops will have to be of reasonable size. Joe may offer additional thoughts.
Dusty
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[GH] Joe libeu sends this :
Gordy,
In the preamble we ask for loops unless specified to be 3 feet or so. On this task it was felt that we are looking for loops that fit the individual. Some people on long casts can throw very narrow loops on the distance, yet others throw larger loops. I look for loops that are 3 to 4 feet on front and back. Yet, depending on the individual, this is a variable.
One needs to take many factors into consideration when looking at distance. The main thing that we should look at is loop control; are they parallel, overpowered, are they smooth, tracking issues, haul matching or controlled correctly, haul length and stroke length to match amount of line being held in air, etc.
Casting 85 feet for most individuals should not be a big thing and one should accomplish it without hero casts. If you are having trouble, you should seek a good teacher on distance casting and work with them.
More important, how would you teach someone to cast longer, what style would you work on, how did you determine this, what would be the teaching sequence to build up to longer cast?
Joe
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