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Walter & Group....
>From Troy Miller:
Completely agree with your assessment, Gordy. Beginners tend to have difficulty getting the line moving smoothly. They start too abruptly and the concavity starts immediately – especially as they try to lengthen the amount of line out. As they progress through intermediate casters and toward expert, their technique and distance improve commensurately. So do their goals – to cast 200 feet… so although they may have developed the ability to progressively pull the line into motion, the offending “punch” may show up anytime up to the stop (and I use the word “stop” unashamedly).
It is rare to have a beginner who creates a concave path late in the stroke, and it’s pretty unusual to have an expert create a tail due to slamming the rod early.
With the usual “there are no absolutes” caveat… Hope you’ve been well, Gordy! Had a very good summer’s fishing this year in south central AK. Fishing on the North Slope has been kinda spotty. Fish are here one day and gone the next.
Regards,
Troy Miller ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>From Craig Buckbee:
Gordy,
Lefty has a wonderful saying about the double haul enabling casters to throw tails further out.
I agree.
I also see students reaching to attain distance beyond their comfort range (... as we all do at times to grow as casters ! )
releasing the haul too soon.
Another common tail cause I see is an Arc too small given the length of line trying to be cast. Bruce Richard's article
in the Spring 2012 LOOP clearly describes facets of this scenario.
Craig
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[GH] Craig,
Yes. I've also heard Lefty say, "Some casters use the double haul to throw their mistakes farther."
The castling arc being too narrow for the amount of line being cast is one of the prime reasons for a tail. Argument exists as to whether this is because it leads to the need for a spike of force to move that much line with that narrow arc with the result of a concave tip path or whether the tail can happen even without the improper use of force. Bruce Richards favors the latter. I'm on the fence. I guess there is a fine line between "improper application of force" and the use of enough force to actually make the cast with smooth acceleration when the casting arc is insufficient to handle the amount of line carried.
Completing the haul too soon during the stroke can certainly result in a dip and return in the path of the rod tip.... ergo. a concave tip path leading to a tail.
Gordy
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>From Tim Kempton:
Gordy
The photo of lefty shows the fly leg traveling below the rod leg…this is because Lefty casts at an angle to the side of his body. When viewed from the side, it appears that he has tight loops. In my view these are not tailing loops.
regards,
Tim
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[GH] Tim,
The apparent shape of the loop does, indeed, depend upon the perspective of the observer with respect to the loop plane. Putting it another way, a loop formed with the casting plane (rod plane) vertical will appear different than a loop of the same dimensions formed with the cast made in an off-horizontal plane.
HOWEVER:
If you take the time to review the 8 photo frames of Lefty's cast you will note that the cast yielding the tail is made with the rod in an almost vertical plane. * I've watched Lefty demonstrate this many times.
* CASTING WITH LEFTY KREH, by Lefty Kreh, 2008, pp. 405-408.
Gordy
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From Bernd Ziesche:
Hello Gordy,
no doubt not a single tailing loop from one student will ever look the same like the one of any other student. There might be similarities though.
The cause is the same?
Well, then why does any student need a teacher to help him/her about tailing issues? We can just explain the one cause and that's it!?
I don't agree here. ;)
The cause for a tailing loop is not tip path. The causes are the exact movements of the caster. And indeed they can be very different. It can be one, two or a whole bunch of causes in combination. Often it is way more then just one cause.
It won't also not just being uneven force application (as I read from time to time).
If we built a casting robot which would be able to accelerate the rod's butt 100% smooth - let's say constant this time - we still can miss timing. We still can miss the correct size of arc and so on and so on...
Understanding all these causes is the key to help of course.
I have a long article about tailing issues on my website. Unfortunately it is in German. I will give it a go for translation in a while.
For those who like google translator they may find it here:
Best
Bernd
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[GH] Bernd,
Yes.
Tailing loops are like snow flakes. No two are identical. With tails, however, some general similarities prevail.
Ally Gowans has pointed out that there are methods of making a tailing loop with no concave rod tip path. One example we've discussed before is the tail made during a cast with less than 180 degrees between the trajectories (line planes) of the back cast and the forward cast.
I agree with you that the CAUSE of the tailing loop is what the caster does. To emphasize this, I like to call that the "root cause". I know some instructors take the position that the cause off a tail is the rod tip path. Don't know if those differences of opinion will ever be muted.
My German is rusty .... but I can understand the basic points of your article. Love to see it translated for our members who speak and read no German.
Gordy
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