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Walter & Group...
[GH] Great suggestions ! Certainly a learning experience for me (and I hope many of you) as we see how different instructors would handle the same teaching challenge.
This is helping me load my bag of teaching tricks !
Dennis will answer us in our next message.
Here are a few more responses :-
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[GH] From Guy Manning :
The caster has too many faults, breaking too many rules, to attempt to cure any particular one first. So my rule is to work with the most important one first. In his case he is not pulling the rod and while solving that I can solve a most of the other issues at once (wrist, waving the rod or casting arc, line handling, pushing, limited length and line slapping the water on each cast, eliminate future tailing).
In this case I would begin by teaching him hand and arm positions, then making just back casts, then just forward casts using a pulling motion. Then putting them together for a pickup laydown, then false casting. I would spend the last 5 minutes showing him the roll cast, which he has already learned by doing just the forward cast.
There are 5 essentials and I do believe in them, but I seldom mention them to a beginner, which this person is, because it is TMI (too much information). We may touch on one or two but only in passing until the person becomes an accomplished intermediate and wants to understand more. I am more interested in teaching them physical positioning that enables them to self-analyze and self-correct for proper practice on their own. This is what builds correct muscle memory.
Guy Manning
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[GH] Jim Valle weighs in . His message expands the concept of "CIRCLES, STRAIGHTS & EIGHTS" :
Gordy and Group,
Sorry to be so late I have been off line for 5 days …. But had to jump in on this ….
Dennis mentions the caster has been casting for two years and is self-taught…
I would take a totally different approach rather than “paralysis by analysis”
First comment, (after a big mental Gulp, to recognize the challenge), then I would say something as complimentary as I could gather up without telling a lie:
“ Really cool to cast a fly line isn’t it, I can see you have really been working on learning to cast, You have the idea and with a little more information and some adjustments we can really fine tune your cast to make it much easier ….”
I’m thinking: Fact is this caster only has the idea of moving the rod back and forth, no concept of the physics or efficiency of a true fly cast.
My approach: I believe a big picture approach to the casters mental image of the cast is the first order of business, obviously he sees the cast as an arm waiving exercise….
So my first task is to correct his image of what a cast is. (This is why Demos have to be done slow and well.) Without saying anything, I might just demo a tight loop pu/ld cast ,just to give him the new image of a correct cast. I might stand beside him (slightly forward so he can see my rod and his) and cast simultaneously and ask what he sees that is different. One way or another I want to make sure he has a new mental picture of the cast.
Next, I want him to gain a feel for the rod/line and movement of his arm, body etc., I would move him to my Cast by Feeling It approach, something totally different which in his mind is simply a warm up exercise, making circles and shapes and then ending with a ready position to a forward stroke with a stop.
Once he puts the new mental image together with a forward stroke to a stop we are on our way. Then I might do a couple hands on casts to reinforce the moves.
Now he has a foundation of “feel” to build on and we can get into all the necessary refinements and everything has remained positive. As far as he knows he never did anything wrong, and is focusing o the feel of the cast, In reality he is applying the essentials he just doesn’t know it… yet.
Now I can work on the refinements and technical as necessary…
I hope those that read this do not dismiss this as simply a nice way to approach a student, or a social workers approach to casting instruction. It is not. I have had great results with this… getting the mental image correct through sensory perception. It is like handing a fly rod to a child and asking them to make a fly cast without ever having seen one, (they will do exactly what Dennis’s student did), They need to understand in their own mind and in their own “personal perception language”(sensations) what the objective is. Words won’t work here, for example, Touch your left hand with your right…describe the feeling, then try and tell me how it will feel to me! …. Better if you let me describe it to myself,
You get the idea.
Hope this helps,
~ Jim Valle ~
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From Ckling Ling :
Hi Gordy,
Sorry was a bit tied up with my kids yesterday. Agree with Gordy circles , eights and straights with a firm wrist to learn constant rod tip loading, variable rod tip loading and end of stroke loading. Once he gets the hang of it, I will proceed to a bit of sidearm casting. Using sidearm casting is easier to learn appropriate arc,timing,stop,tracking and SLP. Only after he can side cast fairly well will I proceed to pick up and lay down and learn about trajectory and slack. All these with firm wrist and fixed length of line. I will advise him to practice same routine on his own.
Cheers,
Ling
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[GH] From Doug Swift :
Gordy
My answers to Dennis' questions
A. I would specify a given length of line for the caster to work with (25-30' outside the rod tip) prior to starting the cast. THEN - ensure the line is free of slack between the rod tip and the fly as it lays on the water. THEN -carry on with very similar instructions that Dennis listed.
B. Since this is a water based cast it would assist the caster in feeling the rod load during the pick up and lay down cast.
C. Focus and try to correct the most glaring fault, which to me is slack line having an effect on the cast. Keep the line hand out of the instruction at this point and ensure the stroke is started low to the water with no slack between the tip and the fly.
Doug.
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[GH] From Bob Hansell :
Gordy,
Just catching up. This work thing keeps getting in the way. I would like to take a stab at the questions:
A. Do you think you would begin with something different ?
Yes, I would move away from the water and on to a field with a tape stretched out in a straight line to demonstrate the straight line rod tip path concept. The student looks to be staring at a point in the water and does not have the 180 degrees concept yet. I would have him do ground casting to see the cast and to see a loop and how it is formed. Another thing I would do immediately is have the student hold the fly line under his rod had at the grip to begin to understand line control. Way to many causes of slack evident in his current performance. I would then move to a side arm casting along the tape so he sees the back cast and the forward cast and gets a sense of timing. Next we could move to the lay down and pick up castling motions on the grass to understand the basics of casting.The only positive I see in the video is a slack line presentation so to keep the guy engaged......
B. Any suggestion on why I might start that way ?
I suggest to get this guy to start thinking about casting versus fishing. Also the student is not watching any of the casts. Beginning through awareness seem to work for me. I cannot see anything in the tape that suggest he is aware of his cast. It looks like he sees a target and is solely focused on that target.
C. What do you think you should do next ?
I would take him through the essential of casting one at a time to build awareness and how each compliments the other. My bet is the student will need some discovery time on one element at a time.
Hope that is in the right direction. Thanks for sharing the video; I agree it adds to the discussion loops dramatically.
Thanks,
Bob
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