Greased Liine Fishing / Quiz / Teaching

Walter & Group....

From Jim Valle :

Gordy and Group,

 

Re: Greased Line

 

Here is a rarity,  I can actually add something to what Gordy has already stated.

 

I know and have fished with Kenny Abrames. I can tell you although he is a bit eccentric, sometimes crotchety and always opinionated,  he is a real striper fisherman, from the old school. He is also a real artist with brush or pen and with fly rod. He usually fishes hard, all night long moving from place to place with a very keen sense of what is going on with tides and wind  and all the other variables. He will wade out in the dark in unknown black water, stand in the surf with the waves crashing over his head, of course he puts his hood up and just turns and lets the wave crash over him. When it comes to wading in the salt and the pursuit of big stripers,  If he can?t scare you no one can. If you ever get the chance to fish with him in Rhode Island?. Do It? it?s a real education!

 

Ken has a couple books out   

STRIPER MOON and A PERFECT FISH: Illusions in Fly Tying. (Available on Amazon.)  The latter describes ?greased line? fishing as Ken uses it for Stripers, actually a very good summary of the method which really deals with mending the line to change the speed and presentation of the fly.( Mending is an art that most instructors don?t spend enough time on.) I find it fascinating and always teach it on the water.  It is line and fly control on the water. ?Greased Line? is a salmon fishing technique, in basic theory a method of presenting your fly broad side to the fish rather than in end view as it drifts toward your fish. Creates the scenario that almost always hooks the fish in the corner of the mouth and by changing line position relative to the current the fisherman can speed up or slow down the fly?s speed, or by a series of mends in different directions and giving and taking line you can control the exact movement of the fly in any current. It is a beautiful thing, I use it all the time in the Salt to hang in a current or to make a fly change direction, you can really extend a drift. Another book I highly recommend on the subject is Greased Line Fishing for Salmon & Steelhead by Jock Scott, written about a gentleman (W M Skues)  who actually developed the method. Scott actually wrote the book based on letters  written by Skues. Skues was using silk lines and was ?greasing? them to float and thus allow the mends.

 Hope that helps,

 Jim

Ps Ken has a website Stripermoon.com, baitfish gallery is one of the best.

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                                                                      MORE ANSWERS TO QUIZ

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From Mack Martin :

Gordy:

 

Regarding the answer:

11.)  Joy Dunlop, Al Crise and others made up some fly rods with an extra stripping guide placed a few inches distal to the first stripper.  What was the purpose of this ? Said to groom shooting line better.   Not convinced.  Besides, that arrangment looks dorky.  I am visiting Joy this morning.  We are casting a new 7 wt 2pc bamboo rod, cut to the Dickerson 8014 Guide spec.  

Agree.  I know of no actual studies which prove the claim.  Perhaps Joy knows of one or two. 

 

I have built two identical fly rods, one with and one without the extra guide. The rod with the extra guide typically will cast 10 to 15% further due to the effective friction being reduced. These results come from multiple casts from several casters.

 

 Subsequently we videoed the rods during long casts while shooting line and you can easily see the line slap that occurs on the rod without the extra stripping guide. Additional video cuts show no line contact beyond the extra stripping guide.

 

Mack Martin

AFFS

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Well .... You have done the study in Question.   Many thanks.      G.

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From Jim Barr .....

Gordy- pertaining to my response to your question about the Shakespeare white fiberglass blank- I.e. The Shakespeare "Wonder Rod" - I actually have an artists proof of a painting by Armand LaMontagne entitled "Home Run". This is a painting of Ted Williams holding an Atlantic Salmon on the banks of the Miramichi. Ted is holding in his other hand none other than a Shakespeare Wonder Rod- just like mine!

Link

http://rogallery.com/Lamontague_Armand/lamontagne-home_run.htm

Capt. Jim Barr 401-465-8751 www.SkinnyWaterChartersRI.com

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Jim ...  I tried but couldn't activate the link.

Years ago, I fished with Ted.  We fished bonefish tournaments in the Bahamas.  Ted always went for the trophy awarded for the largest bonefish and I tackled the one for the greatest number.

Gordy

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From Bill Kiester on rod guides :

 

Gordy,

 

I have used REC Recoil guides on several rods, particularly on 10 foot rods.  REC literature indicated that recoil guides are 35% the weight of comparable standard wire snake guides.  The recoil also have very short feet or flat portions of the foot so the thread wraps are very short by comparison to standard snakes.

 

For the rod tips I use the single foot recoil guides.  I split the foot, they are only held together by some shellac like material.  Then I mount them on the tip with one of the split feet on each side of the fly rod blank and wind them tightly.  I have to file the split legs to taper the thread wraps.

 

The recoil guides are a pain.  With regular snakes you only have to tape on foot to the blank and then you can wind the other foot.  With recoils you have to tape both feet down because the flexible feet will scoot away from the thread as you try to wind up the ramp on the foot. 

 

Bill Keister 

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Bill,   Same experience I had when mounting those guides.  My way of doing it is to cut a very thin strip of plastic tape and tape each foot leaving the end of the foot free for about 1/8th ".   Then I wrap each foot removing the tape when the wrap arrives at the tape point.

Thanks for the tip on the tip-tops !  I hadn't thought of that.

Gordy

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From Liam Duffy:

Hi Gordy,
             I was just reading (sorry been away from my computer) about fly rod materials. Here's one that was used in
Ireland in the late 40's (after the war) it wasn't great but "necessity is the mother of invention" I got this from my father. Due to lack of EVERYTHING some people here used believe it or not "radio antennae (aerials) from Sherman tanks!!!. Apparently these were war surplus and the Irish got hold of them and turned them into fly rods.  My fathers rod was one of these and he told me the history of his "fly rod" Any one else heard of this?
Best Regards,
Liam Duffy

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Liam...   Interesting !   I hadn't heard of that.  Darn clever.         G.

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                                                              TEACHING FLY CASTING - Alien Waters

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From Troy Miller :

I really enjoy our discussions that deal with real-life applications.  Yes, of course you know that I love to talk about the technical aspects of flycasting, but I wonder how many instructors really concentrate on helping their students figure out how to invent the optimal cast needed, real time.  I?ve had ?discussions? with other CCIs and Masters about what is the most logical and beneficial sequence of instructional topics.  Do we teach ?how? first (purely mechanics), or abstract concepts first (paint the big picture)?  I?m a firm believer that a student of ANYTHING will learn faster and more completely if she/he understands the context of the material before delving off into the material itself. 

 

To that end, I consciously attempt to connect new thoughts with existing thoughts for my student.  From the absolute, ?never-held-a-flyrod? beginner ? to the expert level caster that is more technically proficient than me in every way.  I start every class with some of the same questions that other instructors do ? Anybody here ever flycasted before?  Anybody need a restroom?  Anyone thirsty?  What?s the difference between flycasting and all other forms of fishing casts (spinning, spin cast, baitcast, cane pole, etc)?  For me personally, it is critical that I make the profound distinction that we are casting THE LINE in flycasting, and not the terminus.  I go one step further in clarifying that there?s really no such thing as flycasting, but rather, flylinecasting.  When this revelation sinks in, it becomes obvious why SLP is important (and all of the resultant mechanics of the cast).  Within the first 15 minutes of class, every one of my students recognizes that the fly is merely a hitchhiker to my flyline and leader.  

 

When the relational concepts of equipment and technique are fundamentally understood, we THEN tiptoe into the mechanics.  As each cast is initially presented, it is preceded with a brief summary of its practical usage.  ?Sometimes, the current will be flowing really fast in the middle of the stream, but the fish is rising in the slower water on the other side.  We have several types of casts/presentations which will greatly increase your chances of catching that fish.  Here is one way to attack that challenge??  The student then immediately possesses context for the cast demonstrated.  How many instructors say ?When we need to increase the length of our drag-free float, we can place an upstream aerial mend, which looks like this???  Bombarding the student with technical jargon without explaining the usage in everyday language is a terrible pitfall for the expert instructor ? and many times we don?t even realize we do it!

 

I like your nomer ?alien waters?.  Even familiar waters can behave as alien as environmental factors change.  We must approach each fishing situation as unique to today if we expect consistent success.  A short period of reflective observation will help us craft an effective plan of attack for any angling situation.  Once that is established, inventing effective casting strategies is easy and fun.

 

A favorite quote:

 

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction." -- A. Einstein

 

And another:

 

"The task of leadership is not to put greatness into humanity, but to elicit it, for the greatness is already there." -- J. Buchan

Regards,
Troy Miller
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From John McDiarmid :

Gordy,

 

I find being left handed has some advantages when teaching right handers.  I line up beside them, put our casting arms up together, side by side, and demonstrate how short the stroke is.  Beginners almost always go to far forward before the stop.  When they see how far I go, they get the idea.  Very helpful.  I have been working on casting right handed and now have it ok.  Learning the double haul with the left hand is progressing very slow.  When you think about it, out here on the river, half the cast can be from the other side and sometimes when you need to come in low under brush with a curve, a cross body or back hand delivery is just not as affective as presenting with the off hand.

 

My fishing has been high mountain lakes and streams plus steel head rivers.  This winter I fished bones on the flats and from a skiff for the first time.  Loved it.  What I did not anticipate was the difference between the skiff and flats fishing. On the skiff, I made longer cast and aerialized more line with the running line  coiled on the deck similar to practicing in the grass.  On the flats, I had to manage all the line and get off shorter cast with less aerialized line.

 

John MacDiarmid 

 

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John,  Good way of handling the teaching of "other handed students" !   The haul is the most difficult thing for most.

 

 On those bonefish flats, you taught yourself something that is on the latest version of the Masters Test:  Making the "saltwater quick cast" as from a skiff and then as when wading.  The task is an "explain and demonstrate" one.  The examiners expect the candidate to point out the differences and the ways of coping.

 

Gordy

 

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