Correction / Carl Zarelli's answers / Heavy weighted flies

Walter & Group....

From Ally Gowans . My comments in his text in blue italics.    G.:

Hi Gordy,

 Just a few comments on recent answers.

 

Dry fly fishing was almost certainly practiced before Halford and H S Hall popularised it and indeed the method was featured in The Field magazine dated Dec 17 1853. Fosters of Cheltenham sold split wing dry flies as early as 1854. James Ogden another Cheltenham tackle dealer claimed to be the first to use dry fly during the 1840?s  but doubtless others used floating flies before that and perhaps they were used in other countries where the written evidence is lacking. Apparently the first trout caught on a dry fly on the R Test was in 1888 but Thuddeus Norris used dry fly in Philadelphia as early as 1864. The Field article in 1853 also described false casting charmingly named the ?Carshalton dodge?. In any event it seems probable that lines were greased and dry flies were fished before eyed hooks were used but the eyed hook and the discovery of paraffin as a waterproofing medium certainly lead to improvements. Who first attempted to make a fly line float and when will probably never be known.

 

Arthur Wood certainly deserves the credit for developing the greased line method of fishing for Atlantic Salmon but he most certainly would not have been the first to grease a fly line.

 

I also noticed a reference to a ?constant tension? cast. ?Constant tension? would be the same force acting in exactly the same direction at all times. Constant tension during a cast is impossible but in all casts the line is ?constantly tensioned? which is of course means something completely different.

The term I used was CONTINUOUS TENSION, not constant tension.  I simply borrowed it from the description in the fly casting literature referring to the European style of casting popularized by Hans Gebetsroither.  I look at continuous tension as the maintainence of some degree of tension (different forces) while I'd consider constant tension as tension which remains unchanged.  As you point out, "the same force".    G.

 

P.S. I have a whole presentation devoted to Wood, his astonishing inventiveness and to Cairnton where he fished on the R Dee. Unfortunately the presentation uses transparencies because it was written a number of years ago and cannot be shared on-line.

 

 

Best wishes,

Ally Gowans

 

 

In my previous message a Freudian slip caused me to write Alexander Wood when of course I should have typed Arthur Wood! Below is a picture of Wood fishing, he cast a 12ft built cane rod single handed which sounds taxing but he was a huge man who had to have special almost double width coat-hangers made for his clothes!

Ally

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Note the attachment ..... a picture of Arthur Wood with his long single handed fly rod.     G.

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Here are Carl Zarelli's answers to historical questions:

 

Hi Gordy my answers in green.

Sometimes you have to wonder if the sources you derive the information from  is truly accurate . I think in this case it is more a matter of who actually brought this technique out to the forefront . There may of been others who greased their lines, but Arthur Wood certainly made it well known. 

 

Carl  

 

 

 

 Here were my answers :

Hi Gordy ask your group the following questions and see who can get the correct answers .

 

What technique was used to get silk lines to float ?  

 

  It was reported that he used the rendered grease from a red stag . But who knows for sure . What we do know is that he was an engineer  a likely a  tinkerer . He kept meticulous logs of his fishing activities which his relatives have to this day.

 

In what year ( approximately )  was this line technique made popular ?   

 Approximately early 1900 's I would agree with 1903 .   

 

 

On what river did this person fish ?  

 

It was the Dee 

 

Who was this person ?  

 

Arthur H E Wood  

 

What advantages did this provide  the person fishing that others did not have ?  

I agree  . I gave his the ability to provide floats "as natural as a leaf floating down river" .

 

Where can you see this information that is on display  and open to the public today?   

 

It is said this information lies in a fly fishing museum in Banchory Scotland ( on the Dee ) .  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Keep up the great work Gordy !

 

Carl

 

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                                                     CASTING HEAVILY WEIGHTED FLIES

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From Dan Pangaldi. My brief comments in his text in italics.   G.:

Gordy,
 
Great story, I can visualize the whole thing... you're blessed...Gull Wing Cast...awesome.
 
I'm assuming we're casting the heavily weighted flies on a floating line for this discussion.      Yes.   G.
 
Try to remove the barbs from hooks as a safety measure also.   I use barbless hooks for most fish ... except tarpon.   G.
 
False casting heavy flies can be keep to a minimum when a smooth lift water haul (matching the haul intensity to the lift intensity) is used after a couple of roll cast pick-ups to get the fly to the surface.  You'll have practically the whole head out of the tip top and be in good position to make your back cast, slip a few feet of line now having the proper amount of overhang, form an open loop and make your forward cast.  I'm lazy and lead and tungsten hurt not to mention the hook. 

Agree.   Roll casting to the surface, then using a roll cast pickup works for both heavy flies and sinking lines.   G.
 
 
Thanks, for the tip on the slow check haul to straighten the leader.  At times I want the leader to straighten for better accuracy when sight fishing for stripers on wind blown flats with heavy flies.
 
 
Regards,
 
Dan Pangaldi

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 From Dan Storaska :

Gordy,

It's been a while since I've commented to the group as I've been in and out of the country, but I have been following along over the last several months.  I'm sorry that I missed your class this time but look forward to making it to the conclave in the future, to meet you and many of the other fine folks of this great endeavor we call fly casting.  This past one I missed due to my 10 year wedding anniversary.  My wife allowed me to 'sneak away' for a day (actually she came with me) and we headed to a small island off of the coast of the Yucatan Peninsula called Holbox.  There I went on my first tarpon fishing excursion and it was fantastic.  Thank you so much for all of the posts related to casting/playing and landing tarpon over the last few months as these were invaluable.  I missed an opportunity to land a giant tarpon off the coast earlier in the day (I had hooked it, but did not set the hook properly and promptly lost it - alas it was a great experience nonetheless!) but was able to land 4 baby tarpon in the flats later in the afternoon.  I'm attaching a picture of one of them. 

I spent several weeks practicing with my 10 weight for this trip and worked on casting heavily weighted flies into the wind as much as possible.  One technique I still haven't mastered is shooting line on the final backcast before the presentation cast.  Do you find that you must maintain tension on the line during that final backcast by keeping contact on the line with you line hand?  I find that if I simply allow the line to be shot 'free' that the tension on the line is reduced and I experience a great amount of slack which must be pulled out on the corresponding final delivery cast and typically results in many shock waves.

Dan

 

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Dan...

   Congratulations on some proper preparation and good fishing !

I do maintain tension on the line during the final back cast unless I use a back cast shoot.  Even then, I maintain enough tension to avoid slack as I shoot line through a ring made by the thumb and forefinger of my line hand. (This is something I learned years ago from Lefty Kreh.)

Also.... I maintain control of the line as I shoot it on the forward cast in the same manner.  By doing that it accomplishes several things:

1.) Reduces the liklehood of slack which can result in a line tangle as the line shoots up from the deck, water or ground.

One way this works well for me is to put my line hand with the ring made by my thumb and finger DIRECTLY OVER THE CENTER OF THE COILS OF LINE ON THE DECK OR GROUND.  That way, the line being shot comes straight up from the coils and not from one side !

(Another trick:  If you wish to reel in line from that pile of coils on your deck, do so slowly with your reel placed as close down to deck level as you can and off to one side .)

2.) I have control which allows me to make an immediate check haul if needed.  Or abort the cast.  I can also change direction during false casting on either my back cast or forward cast if my target (fish) moves.

3.) Allows me to start my strip immediately after the fly lands when that is desired.

4.)  One VERY important thing....  I can keep my eye on the fish and not have to search for the line ..

Caveat :   I'll admit, once and a while I forget to do this.  In order to keep my eye on the fish when I've dropped the line from my line hand, I slide my line hand out on the butt section of the rod to the first stripper guide ......  MY LINE IS ALWAYS THERE !    (I taught myself that trick years ago while striper fishing at night.)

Gordy

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From Rene Hesse:

Gordy,

 

I can picture you making that 'Immortalized GULL WING CAST'---I had a big smile on my face when I read your post.

 

Being late to the party on casting a weighted fly,

SLOOOOW DOWWWWN is the best short answer I can give.

 

Glad your back,

Rene

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From Dusty Sprague on Mark Sedotti :

Gordy, you might pass the following on to the group.

 

Mark will be demonstrating his casting technique of those outrageously large flies at our upcoming FFF Florida Council Conclave in Orlando on October 23 and 24. 

 In addition to Mark we have an excellent line-up of casting events, fly fishing presentations, fly tying demonstrations, equipment manufacturer's displays and instructor certification testing.  Join us if you can.

 

Dusty 

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