"170 cast" / KISS principle /

I have had the pleasure of casting with Chase, at the Casting Rendezvous (Livingston MT. Conclave) the amount of line he aerializes is amazing and with great loops, I must say however that this is a young caster’s cast … don’t think I’ll be practicing bending my back like that too often… but there is always something to learn … and it certainly demonstrates what can be achieved with a fly rod.

My feeling re the hauls is that we have to be careful not to confuse the RSP with the lay back position , they may not be the same. I would contend that the haul in the video is actually ending at the RSP position ( the bent loaded rod reaching its full length is the point that the loop forms), the remaining movement is drift to a layback position in preparation for the next forward cast. The additional 10 degrees of drift corrects the 170 to 180 on the forward cast.

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Jim... Without the use of super high speed video (like 1000 fps +) it is very difficult to tell if there was a brief "stop" followed by either layback or back drift OR bringing the rod all the way back with neither and unloading it there.

As you know, these are all ways of increasing stroke length and rod arc available for the next cast.

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Hi Gordy,

The 2 things that I see in the video are; the caster is extending his casting stroke by what looks to be about 25% thereby getting a load well into the butt of the rod. On the forward cast he is slip loading (he has too otherwise he would fall over) again getting the load well into the butt. I'm sure there are other things that make the cast work, without seeing the full forward cast I'm not sure what they may be. With my back, I think I'll leave this one to the younger casters that still have a good back.

On Les's comment about the depth of some of the subjects; with only a high school education some of this stuff is way way over my head. Fortunately I work with one of the other members of the study group, he explains the physics (as best he can) in a manner that I understand. Having some knowledge of the depth helps me explain things in a KISS method, and if necessary I can go a little deeper with a student.

Regards

Pat Blackwell

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Pat... I agree on the stroke length .... even more important is the appearance of his matching rod arc to rod bend as he does this. THAT is one secret to accomplishing loop control.

Finishing with the rod tip way back whether by drift or by coming to a conclusion with the tip all the way back and unloading there, this provides maximum stroke length and rod arc for the following forward stroke.

I can't make that bend, either !!! Wouldn't dare try it. I respect the fact that it works for some.

As you could see in my last note, I'll try to present a bit more KISS added to some of the more complicated messages. One shouldn't have to be a PhD. or a professor to be a really great instructor of fly casting ! Without mentioning any names, I can tell you that the most effective instructor I know has a high school education. My father had an eighth grade education yet was a good teacher of fly casting and a superb caster .... one of the very first salt water fly fishermen.

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On the 170 cast. Tim Rayjeff uses this style or showed it at Southern Council Conclave last year. He spoke of how his brother could move his hand fast enough to get the rod loaded and the line moving But He had to reach way back and turn his body so as his line hand shoulder was back at the end of the cast. 180 turn.

On 'Teaching to the Test' I like to call it bring up details that many miss in just reading.

Lefty, Joan, Mel were GREAT at making a few words mean so much cover so many points.

Like Lefty's "Speed up and Stop" Joan's "Loading move, Power Snap". Mel's "Whumping the rod". Look at what the committee has gone through to define these.....???

Al... you are very good at doing that .... covering the subjects, yet not "giving answers" without understanding. G.

My Student yesterday was well read on all the gurus. He just did not stop the rod in time.

Open arcs and no stroke. To him it was just what they were saying he was doing. He left here mad at himself for working so hard at casting. When all he had do so was have a little help.

Well.... that is why we have instructors. It would be a rare person, indeed, who could learn to cast efficiently by reading books ! G.

Will that work for my CCI Study Group Drop out for 6 months And I can test them?

I suspect the ruling would be the same... but best get it directly from the Ethics Committee to be certain. G.

I copied Gary Davison input on Spey casting. That was really well done I thought. Step by step he took you through the cast. I will use that in a class hand out some day. Thanks Gary.

One thing I could add is Higher line speed, tighter loops. I also would use a low side arm delivery as Al Buhr would use to fight or over come the wind. I would also put my 4 wt spey rod away and use my 10-11 wt.

Casting principles would be the same no matter the tackle weight, but (up to a point) the heavier designation tackle would handle a strong wind a bit better. G.

This has got to be the windiest winter I can remember 25-30 mph almost every day.

ol Al

--
Allen Crise
FFF Master Casting Instructor
Hawk Ridge Flycasting School

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